Death toll rises to 28 in Connecticut school shooting
By The Associated Press
This article was originally published December 14, 2012 at 9:36 a.m. Updated December 14, 2012 at 4:55 p.m.
PHOTO BY AP/ THE JOURNAL NEWS
Parents walk away from the Sandy Hook Elementary School with their children following a shooting, Friday, Dec. 14, 2012 in Newtown, Conn.
- Comments (173)
- aAFont Size
Obama Describes 'Overwhelming Grief'
An emotional President Barack Obama wiped at tears as he mourned the killings of students and teache...
Raw: Connecticut Police Search Woods After Shooting
Dozens of police officers are searching a Connecticut elementary school Friday after a deadly shooti...
Police: Students, Staff Shot at Conn. School
Connecticut state police Lt. Paul Vance says that staff and students at Sandy Hook Elementary School...
Sandy Hook Elementary School Shooting
The massacre of 26 children and adults at Sandy Hook Elementary school elicited horror and soul-sear...
NEWTOWN, Conn. — A man opened fire Friday inside two classrooms at the Connecticut elementary school where his mother worked as a teacher, killing 26 people, including 20 children, as youngsters cowered in corners and closets and trembled helplessly to the sound of gunfire reverberating through the building.
The killer, armed with two handguns, committed suicide at the school and another person was found dead at a second scene, bringing the toll to 28, authorities said.
Police shed no light on the motive for the attack.
The rampage, coming less than two weeks before Christmas, was the nation’s second-deadliest school shooting, exceeded only by the Virginia Tech massacre that left 33 people dead in 2007.
Panicked parents looking for their children raced to Sandy Hook Elementary School in Children at the kindergarten-through-fourth-grade school were told to close their eyes by police as they were led from the building.
“Our hearts are broken today,” a tearful President Barack Obama, struggling to maintain composure, said at the White House. He called for “meaningful action” to prevent such shootings.
Youngsters and their parents described teachers locking doors and ordering the children to huddle in the corner or hide in closets when shots echoed through the building. Authorities didn’t say exactly how the shootings unfolded.
They also gave no details on the victim discovered at another scene, except to say that the person was an adult found dead by police while they were investigating the gunman.
A law enforcement official identified the gunman as 20-year-old Adam Lanza, the son of a teacher. A second law enforcement official said his mother, Nancy Lanza, was presumed dead.
Adam Lanza’s older brother, 24-year-old Ryan, of Hoboken, N.J., was being questioned, the first official said. Earlier, a law enforcement official mistakenly identified Ryan as the shooter.
Both officials spoke on the condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak on the record about the unfolding investigation.
The gunman drove to the school in his mother’s car, the second official said. Three guns were found — a Glock and a Sig Sauer, both pistols, inside the school, and a .223-caliber rifle in the back of a car.
Lanza’s girlfriend and another friend were missing in New Jersey, the official also said.
State police Lt. Paul Vance said 28 people in all were killed, including the gunman, and one person was injured.
Robert Licata said his 6-year-old son was in class when the gunman burst in and shot the teacher.
“That’s when my son grabbed a bunch of his friends and ran out the door,” he said. “He was very brave. He waited for his friends.”
He said the shooter didn’t utter a word.
Stephen Delgiadice said his 8-year-old daughter was in the school and heard two big bangs. Teachers told her to get in a corner, he said.
“It’s alarming, especially in Newtown, Connecticut, which we always thought was the safest place in America,” he said. His daughter was fine.
Mergim Bajraliu, 17, heard the gunshots echo from his home and ran to check on his 9-year-old sister at the school. He said his sister, who was fine, heard a scream come over the intercom at one point. He said teachers were shaking and crying as they came out of the building.
“Everyone was just traumatized,” he said.
Richard Wilford’s 7-year-old son, Richie, is in the second grade at the school. His son told him that he heard a noise that “sounded like what he described as cans falling.”
The boy told him a teacher went out to check on the noise, came back in, locked the door and had the kids huddle up in the corner until police arrived.
“There’s no words,” Wilford said. “It’s sheer terror, a sense of imminent danger, to get to your child and be there to protect him.”
On Friday afternoon, family members were led away from a firehouse that was being used as a staging area, some of them weeping. One man, wearing only a T-shirt without a jacket, put his arms around a woman as they walked down the middle of the street, oblivious to everything around them.
Another woman with tears rolling down her face walked by carrying a car seat with a young infant inside and a bag that appeared to have toys and stuffed animals.
The shootings instantly brought to mind episodes such as the Columbine High School massacre that killed 15 in 1999 and the July shootings at a movie theater in Aurora, Colo., that left 12 dead.
“You go to a movie theater in Aurora and all of a sudden your life is taken,” Columbine principal Frank DeAngelis said. “You’re at a shopping mall in Portland, Ore., and your life is taken. This morning, when parents kissed their kids goodbye knowing that they are going to be home to celebrate the holiday season coming up, you don’t expect this to happen. I think as a society, we need to come together. It has to stop, these senseless deaths.”
Read more on this story in tomorrow's Arkansas Democrat-Gazette.
Comments on: Death toll rises to 28 in Connecticut school shooting
To report abuse or misuse of this area please hit the "Suggest Removal" link in the comment to alert our online managers. Read our Terms of Use policy.
You must login to make comments.
wterris12141031 says... December 14, 2012 at 12:16 p.m.
If one of those teachers had a gun, they could have prevented some of those deaths.
( permalink | suggest removal )
SRBROTHERINLAW says... December 14, 2012 at 12:27 p.m.
Once again the gun nuts will have a field day trying to ban weapons. It was not the guns people it was the nuts with the guns. They should be hung from the closest tree with public tv air time.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 14, 2012 at 12:28 p.m.
So guns in the classroom is the answer.
No wonder the world thinks we're crazy.
( permalink | suggest removal )
LRLawyer says... December 14, 2012 at 12:49 p.m.
Dj, that's a pretty sick comment in my opinion. I'm a life member of the NRA and I don't see anything funny here. Some SOB just killed kids. Did you miss that part of the story? This is a tragedy. Most of these people and their families will be scarred for life and you make jokes about champagne? No sense trying to talk sense here.
( permalink | suggest removal )
MATYCHY says... December 14, 2012 at 12:56 p.m.
Do any of you really think that a teacher with a loaded gun on his/her desk would have saved lives. Think this through. I do not want a ban on guns. But I probably want the 2nd amendment to go back to the beginning. These guys were not protecting themselves from harm and not looking for their next meat. This was not a war zone, even though it feels like it. I am so sorry this happened, I wish with everything in me, this would be a safe place to live. People in Syria expect this kind of tragedy. As often as we have experienced these kind of tragedies. We don't expect it.
( permalink | suggest removal )
coneal30 says... December 14, 2012 at 12:56 p.m.
this is tragic
and now all the anti-gun people will use it for their agenda. if the psycho that did this didnt have a gun, it would have been a bomb... or anything else he could get his hands on. a ban on guns is not the answer. "guns in the classroom" no, but thank for that melodramatic answer. how about an armed security guard? when i went to school we had security guards, and they had mace.
( permalink | suggest removal )
plowboy says... December 14, 2012 at 12:57 p.m.
its clear every knew the answer to the problem they needed to call someone with a gun
( permalink | suggest removal )
NoodleOne says... December 14, 2012 at 1:01 p.m.
I agree with LRLawyer. DJ, your an idiot.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BarichMilhusseinObamaNixonPOTUS says... December 14, 2012 at 1:24 p.m.
I would say djigoo is a despicable scumbag with a very low IQ; there is never a good time to joke about something like this.
( permalink | suggest removal )
plowboy says... December 14, 2012 at 1:27 p.m.
yep DJ needs turned loose where there is some action so he can see what the hell it takes,
( permalink | suggest removal )
TimberTopper says... December 14, 2012 at 1:33 p.m.
Lifetime gun owner here. So somebody come up with the answer, how do we keep guns out of the hands of nuts and criminals? Something has got to stop this from being done.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BarichMilhusseinObamaNixonPOTUS says... December 14, 2012 at 1:43 p.m.
I do not own a gun but I read that he had 2 9MM and a .223 rifle. I'm pretty sure some police dept. use 9 MM, is the .223 a hunting rifle? I just know this a horrible tragedy and scary as heck
( permalink | suggest removal )
hogfan2012 says... December 14, 2012 at 2:54 p.m.
Dear Lord, please be with the families of those killed and please be with the poor children who have been traumatized by what they have witnessed. Give the counselors and doctors the wisdom to make the right decisions to make positive impacts on their lives.
( permalink | suggest removal )
RZRBKINTXS says... December 14, 2012 at 2:58 p.m.
This is just horrifying. Same story, different day.
I'm sure we'll find, as details emerge, that this guy was mentally disturbed and people around him just refused to do anything about it, just like the Aurora and Portland shooters. What is the common thread here? Guns? Sure, but if you look deeper, you always find a history of unaddressed mental issues that ultimately explode into a tragedy.
These incidents, while tragic, are merely the symptoms of our larger societal, cultural, and moral decline. Gun bans are not the answer, nor are armed teachers. What you are witnessing is a society destroying itself from within.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 14, 2012 at 3:39 p.m.
Amen to Hogfan 2012. Djigoo is worse than an idiot. He is a crass coward incapabe of empathy. Prayers for djigoo as well. Is it asking too much to focus on prayer and leave the gun control debate for another day?
( permalink | suggest removal )
23cal says... December 14, 2012 at 3:44 p.m.
Way to go, Hogfan. So far you are the only one on here to exercise your compassion and humanity instead of using this tragedy as a political opportunity to promote either your pro- or anti- gun ideology. Is it too much to ask to have some time to mourn and pay respects, without jockeying for political advantage for our pet causes?
( permalink | suggest removal )
nwar says... December 14, 2012 at 4:24 p.m.
Yes, this will undoubtedly stir up all the anti-gun folks, as it should. It should stir up everybody. Why can't this country have an adult conversation about common sense restrictions on gun ownership. Why can't we at least look at getting rid of gun show exemptions and having strict registration with required training requirements? Why can't responsible law abiding citizens have reasonable weapons to be used for hunting and self-defense and outlaw assault weapons and large magazines that enable crazies to do the most damage possible in such a short period of time? Why not?
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 14, 2012 at 4:41 p.m.
Oh, no! I've lost the illiterates! How SHALL I go on?
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 14, 2012 at 4:42 p.m.
Hey, Packman...When IS the proper time to talk about gun control?
ht tps://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.ne t/hphotos-ash4/835_10151232171633521_1458244638_n.jpg
( permalink | suggest removal )
BarichMilhusseinObamaNixonPOTUS says... December 14, 2012 at 4:53 p.m.
Djigoo go away you loser. You already had your original post deleted because you are pathetic. You had to use your politics to try to make a joke because you have no brain. After your initial post your thoughts are worthless, just like yourself.
( permalink | suggest removal )
HM2 says... December 14, 2012 at 5:25 p.m.
You can see down the road what's going to happen , the left wing wacko's will demand everyone turn in their guns , join hands and sing kum ba yah, while our socialist/ progressive dictator sheds phoney tears on tv. when really he's laughing inside knowing he's won another battle against the constitution. well , I've got a NEWS FLASH for ya barry, the war ain't over yet.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 14, 2012 at 7:19 p.m.
RZRBKINTXS has it right. Anyone that could do such a thing had to have some mental issues not addressed.
Speaking of mental issues, I hope DJ doesn't own a gun, my Lord in heaven. We all know he hasn't two brain cells so we should pray for him to receive compassion and understanding.
What I don't understand is you Libs are up in arms over this shooting of little children and while that's unthinkable and heartbreaking, so is the abortion of little defenseless babies.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 14, 2012 at 7:29 p.m.
I don’t want to hear “Gun don’t kill, people do”. I don’t want to hear the spin from the NRA. I don’t want to hear about teachers wearing the shoulder holster with their Glocks in the class room. I have had as many as 25 guns, I started hunting at age 6, and I have just purchased a new deer hunting rifle, a bolt action those hold 4 rounds, which is ample for hunting animals. I don’t care if you cannot have your 33 round glock clips for target practice or your 100 round magazines for your AR-15 or your right to buy 6000 rounds of ammunition on the internet. We need background checks for every firearm purchase and at gun shows and ban from selling through the newspaper, without some type of online background check that the seller is responsible for and a waiting period as well. All of you right wing 2nd amendment gun nuts, you need to look through the eyes of the 7,8, and 9 year old’s that experienced the horror they will live with the rest of their lives. Tell them how tough it will be for you without your 33 round clips and 100 round AR-15 magazines. Tell them how inconvient it will be for you to have to wait for a background to pick up your glock at a gun show. That it is your right to be able to purchase 6000 rounds any way you deem appropriate. You people go a take you case to their parents. wterris12141031, SRBROTHERINLAW, coneal30 I would like for you to suggest some solutions for this horrendous action.
( permalink | suggest removal )
ALDEN2 says... December 14, 2012 at 9:09 p.m.
I am in favor of anything that will stop the madness that took place today. That said, if I were a person in authority and responsible for the well-being of someone in my care (ie students, patients, passengers), I would get to a concealed carry class and get permission from my higher ups to carry a firearm. It would be better if no one could threaten those in my care. Since the politicians cannot come up with a better system, those responsible for others well being will need to arm themselves. We need to face reality, and stop wishing things were different.
( permalink | suggest removal )
JakeTidmore says... December 14, 2012 at 10:08 p.m.
When the elderly die, the past dies; when children die, the future dies. How incredibly sad. And, what a monster this Adam Lanza must have been to commit such a terrible act.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 14, 2012 at 10:19 p.m.
So it's okay to ban speech (see: My deleted post), but not semi automatic weapons.
Interesting.
I was under the impression that this was America. Where do all of you jingoistic wingnuts reside?
( permalink | suggest removal )
BarichMilhusseinObamaNixonPOTUS says... December 14, 2012 at 10:35 p.m.
Djigoo they only deleted your post so the rest of the people couldn't see how stupid you are. You should be thankful.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BarichMilhusseinObamaNixonPOTUS says... December 14, 2012 at 10:42 p.m.
Djigoo also please explain how you want to rewrite our Constitution. First Amendment is okay but Second Amendment goes away? Then explain how criminals are going to start obeying laws all of the sudden.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 14, 2012 at 10:56 p.m.
Fish in a barrel.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 14, 2012 at 11:56 p.m.
Just where should one carry a concealed Glock when in the classroom? What palcement for men and women teachers.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 15, 2012 at 12:09 a.m.
Do you think the founding fathers would amend the 2nd amendment today if they would have realized that a Bushmaster could get off about 150 rounds a minute as oposed to their 1 round a minute front loading Hawken? Just asking?
( permalink | suggest removal )
DontDrinkDatKoolAid says... December 15, 2012 at 7:53 a.m.
Nope, but they could reinstate God back into the school system.
( permalink | suggest removal )
RonalFos says... December 15, 2012 at 8:09 a.m.
I think the issue here is that you can't have a society awash in guns and ignore and do nothing about mental health issues in this country. It's too easy and cheaper to ignore or push aside people with mental problems. These kinds of horrible events are going to continue happen until we get serious about dealing with people who cannot function in an open where anyone can get their hands on anything.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 15, 2012 at 9:16 a.m.
Should we also ban violent movies and video games and what will we do about guns brought across the southern border illegally when we are disarmed?
People say why does God let things like this happen? Because WE have thrown Him out of everything.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 15, 2012 at 10:02 a.m.
a sad day for everyone no way to get around it.sorry bill but again you state your lack of knowledge.a hawken is a type of rifle and a rifle is something that very few of our founding fathers lived long enough to see.
more people are killed by drinking and driving than firearms in our country,whats the world think about americans drinking and driving?the guncontrol group says guns and ammo are to easy to get but neither are as easy as a cold drink or a fast car.banning gunshows and making stricter guncontrol laws only affict the law abiding citizens.if there was a way to keep the crazies from getting guns without limiting my rights i`d be all for it but don`t limit my rights for something you can`t control.
goo you have mentioned your a motorhead,i don`t know of a car made today thats not capable of going the speed limit.what right do you have to make one go faster than the speed limit?not saying your wrong because i have my share of toys but as a american i enjoy the right to spend my hard earned money on things i enjoy.while my goat rarely gets out of the garage and my ar rarely comes out of the safe its still fun to get out on a pretty day and play with both of them.
( permalink | suggest removal )
ALDEN2 says... December 15, 2012 at 10:59 a.m.
I don't know where a teacher would conceal a weapon, but at least if they had one they might be able to control the situation (provided they are trained in the use of their weapon). And as for the 2nd amendment, its evident it is not going to be amended. My argument is that we have to respond in a manner they will put a stop to incidents like this one. The only solution I can see is to arm the responsible citizens. Perhaps the irresponsible people will re-think their position, or maybe they will get shot carrying out their perverted plans.
( permalink | suggest removal )
HotSpringsLawyer says... December 15, 2012 at 11:42 a.m.
Get over it. Hard enough to get good teachers as it is. And you want them to be armed guards too? Where would they store their presumably loaded weapon in a class full of kids? Really think they could get the drop on some nut that bursts in the door already firing? From a rapid-fire rifle?
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 15, 2012 at 1:50 p.m.
lazybar, once again, I have no idea what point it is you are trying (and failing) to make. You're not comparing apples to oranges; you're comparing isotopes to fluffernutters. Want to give it another shot?
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 15, 2012 at 2:22 p.m.
goo the point is as a american you have the right to invest your money in the hobbies that you enjoy.some may see your need to build a car that excedes the speed limit pointless and a danger to others the same way some are against a hobby of collecting or shooting firearms other than providing food for your family.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 15, 2012 at 2:34 p.m.
When have I ever indicated otherwise? You'd probably get more out of dialogues if you got rid of your ridiculous habit of putting words in other people's mouths.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 15, 2012 at 2:36 p.m.
December 14, 2012 at 4:42 p.m
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 15, 2012 at 2:39 p.m.
December 14, 2012 at 10:19 p.m.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 15, 2012 at 2:44 p.m.
didn`t see the comment of yours that got removed but i`m guessing it was more of a rudeness issue than freedom of speech
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 15, 2012 at 2:53 p.m.
Neither of my posts supports your assertion. The first one merely proposes we discuss guns, and the second one refers to how easy it is to refute some of the asinine comments here.
Your critical thinking skills aren't very sharp, are they?
I'll ask again...stop putting words in my mouth. It only proves you have nothing worthwhile to contribute.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 15, 2012 at 3:03 p.m.
My comment was nowhere NEARLY as rude as the suggestion that grade school teachers should be packing.
And Freedom of Speech protects ALL speech, rude or not.
The rest of us learned that in elementary school. Were you absent that year?
( permalink | suggest removal )
Jjackk says... December 15, 2012 at 3:29 p.m.
Its God's will so that means its God's fault. He either controls everything or he controls nothing.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 15, 2012 at 8:26 p.m.
jjackk .......Do you read the Bible? Who do you think is the god of this world? For the time being Satan is.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 15, 2012 at 8:55 p.m.
Also, God hates shrimp.
That's in the Bible, too.
( permalink | suggest removal )
HotSpringsLawyer says... December 15, 2012 at 10:20 p.m.
Seems to me that Jesus hated no one.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 15, 2012 at 10:51 p.m.
Amen, HotSpringsLawyer.
( permalink | suggest removal )
ALDEN2 says... December 15, 2012 at 11 p.m.
I'm not sure an armed teacher could do anything to deter a shooter, but an armed teacher has more options than an unarmed one.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Populist says... December 16, 2012 at 7:33 a.m.
Nobody but a policeman should posses an assault rife. There are too many nuts in this world who let their children play video games alone in the basement and are too stupid to get therapy for a kid who is a loner. Also, what kind of parent doesn't make their 20 year old get a job or go to college? With all the kooks in this world, we've got to lock up the assault weapons.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BarichMilhusseinObamaNixonPOTUS says... December 16, 2012 at 7:55 a.m.
Lazybar the comment from Djigoo was that the NRA would be doubling their champagne order after this shooting. I will let you judge it's content; rude is not the word to use.
( permalink | suggest removal )
RonalFos says... December 16, 2012 at 3:52 p.m.
This article written by a mother who's child could be the next mass killer should be read by all. anarchistsoccermom.blogspot(dot)com/2012/12/
( permalink | suggest removal )
Populist says... December 16, 2012 at 7:57 p.m.
Moral of the story. If you have children, take responsibility for them. The father divorced the mom and did not have contact with this child and is, of course, is shocked by what has transpired. This kid has obvious trouble signs of being a loner. Instead of getting him counseling, the mom lets him stay at home and play violent video games and takes him shooting while she keeps a gun collection of assault weapons. This tragedy resulted from bad parenting and the far right digging their heals in on banning assault weapons. The far right will say a responsible gun owner will keep their weapons appropriately locked up. Well, guess what? PEOPLE ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE AND PRUDENT. Let's ban the assault weapons or there is blood on all of our hands if and when this happens agains.
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 16, 2012 at 9:55 p.m.
I would not have wished for this mother to be murdered. She couldn't have deserved that. Yet there seems to be some karma here. She was fixated on guns, especially assault weapons that no respectable civilian needs, exposed her child to guns and took him shooting. She didn't care that the more assault weapons loose in the land, the greater potential for carnage of the innocent. She didn't notice that her son was not a person who should have such ready access to weapons. And it all came right back at her.
Unfortunately, it also got all those children and their brave teachers. All the right wing idiots who froth at the mouth about the "government schools" and the "overpaid" teachers and the teachers' union don't seem to have noticed that after most of these horrible events, we learn of teachers dying or being wounded trying to protect their students. Oh, such horrible government, unionized employees. That lady principal in CT is the bravest person I've ever heard of---far, far braver than any NRA lobbyist or swaggering gun lover.
The Daily Kos has an excellent article with all the quotes of the horrible things tea party candidates have been saying about teachers. On their best day, they'll never be worth one of these teachers on their worst day.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 16, 2012 at 10:03 p.m.
At the moment I own 32 guns including collectibles. Most are handguns and shotguns and none are built on a military style platform (layman's term - assault weapon). This is only to say I'm what liberals would call a "gun nut". Regardless, I fully support effective and sensible gun control laws. I do not believe violent criminals, minors, or the mentally incompetent should be allowed to possess a firearm. I support background checks. I support gun buy-back programs. I also support the 2nd Amendment. I've completed courses on hunter education and concealed carry training. I support mandatory firearms training for anyone wishing to possess a handgun or anything built on a military platform. I tend to support a ban on the sale of high capacity magazines but would do so knowing it is a worthless effort. It's only a minute's difference between firing one magazine of 50 rounds versus 5 magaznies of 10 rounds. There are reasonable measures rational people can support.
Now, consider all the "solutions" offered thus far on this thread to the sadness at Sandy Hook. NONE would have prevented what happened there. There were two ways the tragedy in Sandy Hook could have been prevented. If this were a country where only the police have guns, the crazed gunman's mom would not have possessed the firearm's for her son to steal. The other way this unspeakable tragedy could have been prevented would have been for the lunatic to have been stopped/killed before committing this horrific crime.
It must also be pointed out that if BH Obama had not put the politics of getting re-elected ahead of what he now sees as the public good, he could have began this discussion his first day in office. But he didn't because he knew it would make him a one-term wonder and he didn't have the guts to do it then. Now, however, he, Feinstein, Pelosi, Shumer, and the rest of the gutless crowd will make a lot of anti-gun noise knowing full well they are using the tragic death of 26 innocents purely to make political hay. Something will nevertheless be done, but if you expect it to stop what happened in Sandy Hook you are as out of touch with reality as Adam Lanza, and the coward djigoo.
( permalink | suggest removal )
DontDrinkDatKoolAid says... December 17, 2012 at 12:31 a.m.
Gun buy-back programs. No such thing.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 17, 2012 at 9:12 a.m.
So you have a 27 year old teacher with her 9mm Glock with a 10 round clip, she would still have been outgunned by this nut job with his Bushmaster and 300 rounds of amunition. So you want as part of the Curriculum for becomming a teacher, that he/she needs to have completed their firearms/assault training before being certified to teach in the US. Hey, first graders, welcome to the local school battle ground.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Jjackk says... December 17, 2012 at 9:49 a.m.
I'd call you a gun nut too, but I would still argue for your right to have them. Everybody has their own interests. It is kind of ridiculous to think that guns could or would be removed from society. But guns in schools? I would think that it being a government facility there would need to be a deputy officer assigned there to control it. That would make sense to have a professional to assess security.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Populist says... December 17, 2012 at 11:02 a.m.
We should not ban all guns, but we do need to ban the assault rifles etc. which make it easy and efficient to kill quickly. It also is a shame that these parents just hid their child instead of getting him therapy and working on his socialization skills. Apparently, the mother was trying to get him into a special school in Washington state. This child needed socialization and therapy early on. Letting him sit in his room and play violent video games all the time turned him into a crazy lunatic. What kind of nut takes their antisocial child to the shooting range and keeps guns in the house?
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 17, 2012 at 11:55 a.m.
A dead nut, Populist.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 17, 2012 at 12:14 p.m.
DENVER — Police searched Friday for two men who used a pump sprayer to douse four people with a flammable liquid at a Denver apartment and then set them on fire.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 17, 2012 at 12:15 p.m.
Arkansas repeals Anti-Knife Statute
AKTI Successfully Sponsors Arkansas
Bill That Repeals Knife Ownership As a
Weapons Offense and Protects More
Than One Million Residents and
Recreational Visitors
February 12, 2007
The American Knife and Tool Institute (AKTI)
continues to move forward in its defense of
individual knife owners. More than one million
Arkansas knife owners and knife-owning visitors
can now breathe easier, thanks to House Bill 1235,
introduced by AKTI and signed into law by Governor
Mike Beebe on Friday, February 9, 2007.
The new law totally repealed Arkansas Criminal
Code section 5-73-121 which stated, in part … “(b)
If a person carries a knife with a blade three and
one-half inches (3 ½”) long or longer, this fact is
prima facie proof that the knife is carried as a
weapon.” Rather than try to rewrite the statute,
members of the House Judiciary Committee
actually recommended that the entire statute be
repealed.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 17, 2012 at 12:16 p.m.
let's get rid of flamethrowers and knives and paper with sharp corners, too.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 17, 2012 at 12:52 p.m.
goo,pop,bs,or any of you other liberal posters answer me this.
you want to ban anything labeled as a assualt styled firearm and any high cap mags but are you against selling of sports cars and performance items as well?
you want to ban firearms that are styled after military firearms but should we not also ban jeeps and hummers?
more people are killed by autos than guns every year but you never go after the automakers or the performance parts manufactor,should they not be at fault for making something that will excede the speed limit or go off roading?you will argue that these guns were meant to kill,well if they are only made them to kill someone then sports cars and performance parts should be limited to only proracers to use on a track.drinking should be limited to home use only banning bars and eateries from serving drinks.
you claim guns and ammo are to easy to get but which is easier guns and ammo or a cold beer and a set of keys?
i`m sure one poster will attack my grammer and logic between comparing cars to guns but if you fail to see how they compare you are the one who is dense not i.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 17, 2012 at 1:02 p.m.
Lazybar, again...I never said what you claim I said. Are you mentally challenged?
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 17, 2012 at 1:05 p.m.
Pobucker? Those folks who were burned are still alive. So are the 22 people stabbed in China. The folks in Connecticut are dead.
Do you see the difference? I do.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 17, 2012 at 1:06 p.m.
then answer the questions
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 17, 2012 at 1:10 p.m.
What question? Putting words in my mouth does not constitute a question. Once you stop doing that, I'll answer whatever question you like. Until then, however...no way.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 17, 2012 at 1:18 p.m.
i ask a series of questions and if you believe that we need stricter gun control laws then they apply to you.i am point blank asking you do you feel we need to ban certain firearms?
( permalink | suggest removal )
Populist says... December 17, 2012 at 1:51 p.m.
lazybar,
Cars have useful purposes. Guns can be used for useful purposes such as hunting or security, but assault weapons should be limited to the police for outside their hands they have no important purpose except to kill many people quickly. It already is illegal to drive while intoxicated and to drive recklessly.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 17, 2012 at 2:14 p.m.
On Dec. 13, the National Rifle Association's Twitter account announced a giveaway promotion, thanked its followers for getting its Facebook page up to 1.7 million "likes," and related a story from Wyoming in which a gunman apparently retreated from a nail salon after realizing one of its customers was "packing heat." It tweeted the Wyoming case using the hashtag #ArmedCitizen.
On Dec. 14, the day an armed citizen killed 26 unarmed women and children at a Connecticut elementary school, the NRA's Twitter account went silent. It has not tweeted since. Meanwhile, its Facebook page has disappeared, along with those 1.7 million "likes." Navigating to facebook com/nationalrifleassociation now redirects to the Facebook homepage.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 17, 2012 at 2:20 p.m.
Wayne LaPierre has blood on his hands.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 17, 2012 at 2:24 p.m.
pop,if all cars coming off the lines are capable of going the speed limit why can you buy things to make them go faster?what use does a car that can go over a 100mph have?if driving intoxicated is illegal why are you allowed to drive away from a bar?i have owned a number of military styled firearms and it would be a safe bet i`ve shot over a couple hundred thousand rds in my life but i`ve never killed anyone.just because you have no use for something does not mean someone else doesn`t.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 17, 2012 at 2:33 p.m.
pop if its illegal to drink and drive why do so many die from it each year?does that mean if you banned all the guns you personally have no use for we still will have killings?
i have a citori sporting clays that has one use and its to shoot sporting clays.do you feel that use would justify it not being banned?
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 17, 2012 at 2:50 p.m.
Yes, goo, I see the difference. It obvioiusly takes more training to effectively use a knife or flamethower. So, it is the effectiveness of the gun you hate and not the crazy fool pulling the trigger. You want to make these shootings less effective and you have no drive in you to make them less frequent.
~
Typical nanny attitude. If baby bangs pots, put the pots out of babies reach, don't teach baby not to bang pots.
~
Armed resource officers at every school. That's the answer to protecting our youth.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 17, 2012 at 3:03 p.m.
You're insane, Pobucker.
(See? I can call other people names, too.)
( permalink | suggest removal )
RonalFos says... December 17, 2012 at 3:40 p.m.
Who is going to put up the money for a trained armed officer in every school, church, theater, mall, meeting place all across the US? All you tax whining conservatives? I don't think so.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 17, 2012 at 3:46 p.m.
Hey djigoo - I've got some questions for you, since you've promised answers: Do you squat to p? Do you still gleefully use the word "retard" as hate speech regarding mentally and physically challenged kids? Do you still pull the wings off butterflys? And lastly, is it true you and Barney Frank are charter members in the North American Man/Boy Love Association? Waiting patiently on your response.
Hey Populist - Would you mind to define "assault weapon"?
Hey BillSmith - I have no idea why the NRA deleted its Facebook account and has stopped tweeting, but I would guess it was out of respect for the dead in Newtown because the NRA brass knew both forums would be a lightning rod for unsavory and inappropriate comment on both the pro and anti gun sides. Again, that's just my guess.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 17, 2012 at 3:54 p.m.
Packman, help is available for your illness.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 17, 2012 at 3:59 p.m.
RonFos, I have no trouble with my tax dollars going for armed officers in all those places. The left does, cause pobamma (yo momma) cut security funding for schools. I squeal when I see those welfare debit cards in the hands of healthy men buying cigs and beer (I am not a stinking republican - I'm hatin' the hobnail boot as much as the withered tit).
~
Populist says,
"Gun supporters,
~
If there had been a ban on assault weapons, don't you think Nancy Lanza would have complied and these children would have been alive today? - Maybe, maybe not. Maybe the crazy bastard would of rammed a propane truck through the front door, killing them all.
~
Why should there be weapons where people can kill so many people so quickly? - Because they are a force mulitplier. Sometimes you need to be able kill many people quickly. Let me be clear - Not kill them, just be able to. See below.
~
Why is this necessary or beneficial to society? - It benefits society by keeping the government on notice that there is an armed militia loose in the land. This is WHY we have the right to bear arms!
~
a chorus of amens:
"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." - Abraham Lincoln
~
"There is danger from all men. The only maxim of a free government ought to be to trust no man living with power to endanger the public liberty." - John Adams
~
" . . . And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure." - Thomas Jefferson
~
and finally
The U.S. Declaration of Independence states that "when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government"
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 17, 2012 at 4:06 p.m.
djigoo, you are not the first to declare that, lol
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 17, 2012 at 4:21 p.m.
Hey djigoo - I've got some questions for you, since you've promised answers: Do you squat to p? (Yes, but only in public.) Do you still gleefully use the word "retard" as hate speech regarding mentally and physically challenged kids? (Yes, but only behind their back and/or from the safety of an internet chatboard.) Do you still pull the wings off butterflys? (Only if I can get my boyfriend to catch them for me.) And lastly, is it true you and Barney Frank are charter members in the North American Man/Boy Love Association? (Yes it is true. Want to see my membership card?) Since you failed to answer as promised, I figured I would help. Your welcome, djigoo.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 17, 2012 at 4:22 p.m.
It's pretty damn obvious that Pack is of limited intelligence, has serious anger issues, and is inordinately fascinated with the sexual activity of others, probably because he himself is an unattractive virgin. Also, I'm guessing hygiene issues are a factor.
What a clusterfu€k.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 17, 2012 at 4:24 p.m.
Did you know that "you're" and "your" are completely different words?
Apparently not.
Hell...even Po thinks you're a moron.
( permalink | suggest removal )
multistrada08 says... December 17, 2012 at 4:36 p.m.
Begin tyThis school shooting is a horrible tragedy but the government response will likely lead to more tragedy rather than less. President Obama is likely to push for more gun control which will only serve to create more and more helpless victims. Similar tragedies have occurred in Russia, Brazil, England, Australia, the US and Venezuela all with varying degrees of gun freedom. All these horrible incidents occurred in places where the government had made it illegal for people to have guns. Yet the government response to all of these crimes was less freedom and more laws. No government entity will ever look at any situation and decide the answer is more freedom and less government. ping here...
( permalink | suggest removal )
Populist says... December 17, 2012 at 5:32 p.m.
We don't need more government. We just need to pass a law banning weapons which can kill many people quickly and allow people to turn in their guns. Violators will be treated as any other criminal.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 17, 2012 at 8:43 p.m.
Hey djigoo - Have you scheduled that deductadictomey yet? It appears your estrogen pills are gumming up your works. Better hurry before its too late. And Po can speak for himself, but I believe his post was in reference to your declaration that he was "insane". But I could be wrong. But if not that would make you a numbnuts, at least until the surgery. So, djigoo, in your infinite cheap seats wisdom, if you could wave a magic wand and make any gun control legislation the law of the land tomorrow, what might it be? Either put up or shut up.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 17, 2012 at 9:32 p.m.
RonalFos.....Why not let the teachers' Unions put up the money for resource officers in schools? What better use of union dues. Instead of Union leaders forcibly taking dues from teachers to enlarge their lifestyle and donate to the Democrats, they could put that money to good use.
( permalink | suggest removal )
RonalFos says... December 17, 2012 at 10:31 p.m.
Unions don't pay school system salaries and you know that. If you want armed guards or police in schools they have to be taxpayer funded. Nice Try! And don't expect teachers or administrators to be willing to be armed. Teaching is already so stressful that only about a 3rd of new teachers (who spent 10's of thousands of dollars and years training) last more than 3 years.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 18, 2012 at 12:11 a.m.
Packman, if I had a magic wand, I'd wave it and make cousin-marrying Teabagger idiots with pathological obsessions regarding other individuals' private matters COMPLETELY disappear.
In other words...buhbye!
( permalink | suggest removal )
Populist says... December 18, 2012 at 7:47 a.m.
Packman,
How can you say you are not anti-gay? You constantly are ridiculing Djigoo for being gay. Please stop. Hatred is contagious and makes our community less pleasant. Try to be a decent person; it's the Christmas season. Let me also give you some advice with the ladies. We may date men who make good money, but smart ladies steer clear of marrying mean men. Also, kids and guns do not mix. Statistically, when guns are in the house, it is more likely that a member of the family will be hurt than an intruder. Growing up in Little Rock, there were a few sad stories of people shooting an "intruder" sneaking into the house who actually was a teenage daughter coming in late after sneaking out , and many instances of children dying when playing with guns etc.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 18, 2012 at 9:19 a.m.
goo i`m still waiting.....
pop so what your saying you would like to see people who believe the 2nd gives them the right to own any type of firearm turned into criminals because its your personal belief those guns have no use to the public?your another that can`t answer a simple direct question.so again since my sporting clays gun does not protect me nor put food on the table should it be illegal in your gun restricted world?
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 18, 2012 at 10:04 a.m.
Pop... If you're going to give advice on ridiculing then you should direct it at djigoo. Packman seems like a nice enough guy what makes you so sure he has a problem getting and retaining ladies?
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 18, 2012 at 10:15 a.m.
"Getting and retaining ladies?"
Dollars to donuts T6 has no idea why this is so stultifyingly disgusting.
The only "ladies" Packman has ever "gotten and retained" come with their own repair kit, in case one of them develops an air leak and won't stay inflated.
Pack, I've asked you to stop claiming I've written things which I have never written. Do you simply not recognize that you're doing this? Maybe not; you don't strike me as the brightest bulb on the tree, after all.
And Populist, you and I both know what Freud would say about Pack's obsession with homosexuality.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 18, 2012 at 11:03 a.m.
Hey Populist - Again, you allow your liberal mindset to cloud your judgment. I am in no way anti-gay. I am anti-djigoo. Do not confuse the two. But I will admit I take a little too much pleasure in pushing his buttons. If you want me to stop, I'll stop. But if he ever again uses the word "retard" in a derogatory fashion, I'll be on him like white on rice. Like I've said before, djigoo is a bully and all my life I've taken pride in putting them in their place. As proof, did you notice how he refused to offer his ideas on the current debate? It's obvious he is incapable of critical thought and only able to offer childish catcalls from the cheap seats. Thanks for the advice on women, but I've always been told by the ladies the best thing about me, aside from sex (only kidding......) is my sense of humor. You know what else doesn't mix with kids? ATV's. Do you have any idea how many children have died or been injured over the past 10 years in ATV accidents compared to in-home firearms accidents? If you want to crusade for child safety, that would be a much better place for your efforts. And should I point out the hypocrisy of liberals worrying about child safety outside the womb when you have no concern for those inside the womb? How many babies were aborted last year in America versus those killed by a military platform rifle? If we're going to have a "save the child" debate, let's not forget the hypocrisy of the looney left and their support of abortion on demand.
( permalink | suggest removal )
djigoo says... December 18, 2012 at 11:17 a.m.
Again, how do you know I DON'T advocate for ATV safety? And I don't recall ever discussing abortion here, so there is no way you would no my feelings on that issue.
If you were half as intelligent and noble as you imagine yourself to be, then we might be having an actual dialogue. But you aren't, so we can't.
And the only bully here is you, Pack. So feel free to put your own damn self in your own damn place.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 18, 2012 at 1:26 p.m.
MY GOD, both of you are acting like adolescents. There's dead babies and crazy people and they're packin' heat in the classrooms.
Nannie's want to protect the innocents and stormtroopers want to throw all the nuts in jail.
The constitution is being tested and every extremist, both right and left, is screaming obsenities at the top of their lungs.
Can't we all just get along?
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 18, 2012 at 4:44 p.m.
Hey djigoo - Speaking of half as intelligent, did you men "know" my (your) feelings instead of "no". Again, I challenge you to give a specific law you would recommend if you had that magic wand that would have prevented what happened in Newtown?
( permalink | suggest removal )
ALDEN2 says... December 18, 2012 at 7:35 p.m.
A few legal sounding words on a piece of paper would not have stopped the shooter last Friday. A retired soldier or Marine with a 9mm standing inside the front door might have been able to prevent it. Ok, so maybe the teachers are too busy to add "handgun 101" to their curriculum. If you can't afford an armed guard, maybe the principal or superintendent need to think about firearms training. We need to be able to throw something at a shooter other than a piece of paper that says "Hey, you're not supposed to have that gun!"
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 18, 2012 at 8:04 p.m.
Give me one good reason for a citizen to have a hundred round magazine for a AR-15 type rifle?
( permalink | suggest removal )
ALDEN2 says... December 18, 2012 at 8:44 p.m.
I agree. Outlaw assault rifles and multiple round magazines. If someone wants to shoot that type of firearm they need to join the Army. A law on the books won't do anything about the millions of assault rifles and multi-round magazines already in circulation.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 18, 2012 at 9:09 p.m.
How will we legislate or ban EVIL??????????? Ain't no way!
Do you think the politicians will give up their guns? Ain't no way!!!!!
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 18, 2012 at 10:01 p.m.
We just want to make it more difficult for evil people to get their personal weapons of mass destruction.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Populist says... December 19, 2012 at 6:37 a.m.
Packman,
I am not pro abortion. I am pro adoption. I would ban abortions after the first trimester except when the mothers life is at stake or the fetus is terribly damaged. I would change laws to promote more adoptions.
I will not let my kids ride an ATV.
However, we are discussing a ban on assault weapons here. While Nancy Lanza was a fool, she was a law abiding citizen. There is every reason to believe that a ban on assault weapons would have at least lessened this tragedy.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 19, 2012 at 9:03 a.m.
bs says
Give me one good reason for a citizen to have a hundred round magazine for a AR-15 type rifle?
bs what is the max speed limit in the usa?will your car go faster than that?i`m sure it will,so why can you buy performance parts to make it go faster?a jeep has a high roll over rate,so why are you allowed to buy parts that raises the center of gravity causing them to be more likely to roll over?if 1.5 beers puts the average adult over the legal limit,why are bars allowed to serve you more than that?
i`m done waiting on goo to answer my questions but i really expected pop to answer the question about if my citori,should be banned?while it only has 2 shots without reloading if i shot buckshot out of those 2 barrels into a group of people a good number of people would be hit.since its able to fire multiple rounds so it not be banned as well?
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 19, 2012 at 9:35 a.m.
Abdelbaset Ali Mohmed Al Megrahi,Mohamed Atta,Jim Jones,Timothy McVeigh,and Charles Manson are a few examples that evil people need no type of firearm to commet evil things.even if you could pass a law that banned all firearms you would still have tragic events like this.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 19, 2012 at 10:02 a.m.
Hey there old B.S., I already gave the reason for citizens owning assualt weapons. It is so we can form well organized militia's if the government goes off the rails. That's the reason it is in the constitution. It keeps the government on notice that they cannot screw over the populace. It was very important when it was written and I have no reason to think it is not important now.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 19, 2012 at 10:51 a.m.
Inquire, I fully agree with you that evil people should not have access to assualt weapons. I don't believe in taking a liberty from all people to accomplish that. It is evil to punish the many for the actions of the few. It is the worst kind of easy button, a product of sloppy emotional thinknig. It is something a frustrated mommy would do to her fighting children. "Everybody go to your room and don't come out until I tell you to."
~
The sweet innocent children, the mall shoppers, the theater goers represent a highly valualble and very vulnerable asset. The threat is from a few crazy people with guns. The scarcity of crazy people lowers risk, but the value of the asset demands higher priority. To mitigate the risk, restrict access between the threat and the vulnerable asset (passive mitigation) and place opposition between the threat and the vulnerable asset (active mitigation).
~
You restrict access by locking up crazy people and by locking down schools. Some Arkansas schools have armed resource officers and metal detectors and closed campuses. All schools should have that. You place opposing force by having armed resource officers in all these places. My favorite movie theater has armed guards - that is not wierd.
~
Pay for all this by kicking healthy men off the government debit cards. Obamacare should help lock up the crazy people, too - right? It IS a panacea, right?
~
No where in this analysis is there any suggestion that restricting liberty for all people because of the actions of a crazy few will do any good at all. It doesn't fit any valid models. All it does is satisfy an emotional outrage. Dead Babies.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 19, 2012 at 2:01 p.m.
lazybar.......why can't you answer the question with any reasonable logic except by spouting off topics that have no bearing on the Newtown shooting? Those 6 and 7 year olds don't drive jeeps or high performance cars, hang out in bars, drink beer and the fact is they were shot with an AR-15 not a 2 shot citori. And no one is talking about banning your citori. lazybar, thats like saying I could kill a bunch of deer standing around in a tight formed group, how many deer hunters you know that have killed more than one deer with one shot of buckshot? T6 .....it seams your bible thumping tones down when your ark to pay for all the security guards that would be needed. We we do that, our teachers will have to say to the first graders "Welcome to the Battle ground, instead of the school ground". But, I know that would be all right with you Rambo type wing nuts.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 19, 2012 at 6:43 p.m.
Hey BillSmith - "Give me one good reason for a citizen to have a hundred round magazine for a AR-15 type rifle?" I just bought a Colt AR-15 from a guy who used it to hunt hogs in south Arkansas. He preferred the military platform to a traditional hunting platform for its lighter weight and superior manuervability (sp?) while maintaining sufficient knockdown power for hogs. He said he liked the high capacity mags so he didn't have to carry a bunch of ammo around in a box. He loaded a 30 round magazine and a backup, headed to the woods, and killed as many hogs as possible. That's one. I have more when you are ready. Does the caliber of the firearm matter in your magazine ban?
Hey Populist - There is every reason NOT to believe that a ban on assault weapons would have at least lessened this tragedy. The mom could have acquired the firearm in any number of ways regardless of a "ban". Now, if you meant "confiscation" that's different. If military platform guns are confiscated only law-abiding good guys will comply. Bad guys will be high-giving themselves from sea to shining sea. You good with that?
Your position on abortion is interesting, and germane to this debate because so much of it is driven by the deaths of babies. So, you are good with killing a baby in the womb 90 days after conception but not 91? Isn't the baby just as dead either way? Do you allow your kids to ride bicycles or skateboard? Might want to check out the data on child death and injury related therewith. Do you also want to ban ATV's built on a racing platform with high powered engines?
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 19, 2012 at 7:27 p.m.
Packman, I could give a sh it less about your hog hunters reasons, when 6 and 7 year olds are falling to his weapon of choice.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 19, 2012 at 7:57 p.m.
You right wingers were so sure that you were going to win this time around, you were all chipping in for new curtains in the White House. What good did all the billions you contributed and the superpac were given do to help the outcome. It was your da m n archaic policies that turned voters off, and it's only going to get worse for you people next time. Have a good nights sleep dreaming about yesteryear.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 19, 2012 at 8:13 p.m.
The GOP answer, "Just dress you kids in designer body armour and send them off to school where half of the staff is packing." We will go from school ground to battle ground. And this is what you want America to become? All of you bible thumpers out there, is this the message Jusus was sending with his sermon on the mount?
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 19, 2012 at 8:57 p.m.
Hey BillSmith - "Packman, I could give a sh it less about your hog hunters reasons, when 6 and 7 year olds are falling to his weapon of choice." Thanks for illustrating the arrogance and obstinance of the looney left. You asked a question for which a logical and reasonable answer was provided, and you offer a pithy response based purely on emotion that offers nothing to the debate. Does that make you an idiot, or just a pompous arse? Or both? Does the "weapon of choice" really make a difference to a dead child?
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 19, 2012 at 10:15 p.m.
Packman.....Quit making out you have the child's interest at heart. You have your "guberment goina get ya" ideology at heart.
( permalink | suggest removal )
RonalFos says... December 20, 2012 at 7:12 a.m.
Claiming that having to carry a couple of boxes of ammo instead of a handy 30 round clip is a pretty lame reason for not banning large count clips. Shooters have been stopped when changing clips - see White House shooter under Clinton where bystanders jumped the shooter when he had to change clips. There is no balance between a little inconvenience and an opportunity to stop a shooter.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 20, 2012 at 9:56 a.m.
BillSmith....Are you taunting and mocking Christians? (sarc) Those babies are with the Lord. Sin and Satan took them but they are where WE should all hope to be someday. Maybe Bill you should read the Bible you always quote when convenient for you to mock.
You're "feeling" instead of "thinking" which is what most Libs do. Which is why we have the god awful laws we have. It's pretty typical Libs come up with kneejerk reactions. Instead of laws banning guns, we should be addressing the mental health issue. Most of the mass shooters have been on some sort of psyhcotropic drugs. Maybe we should also put God and the Ten Commandments back in schools and public places.
Also who doesn't think that if "assault" rifles are banned, it won't stop there? When the next mental degenerate kills, a ban will be called for what ever gun was used, until we wake up one day and we are disarmed.That's how mental Liberal politicans work. That's what the Libs want to disarm us. Eventho they have guns to protect themselves.
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 20, 2012 at 11:16 a.m.
Bill, it is impossible to reason with a gun nut. They worship them, and they choose the path of violence. Many are wannabees, chomping at the bit for a chance to show what a "man" they are with their great big gun.
My father was a real man, a career police officer after several years as an MP in WWII. He had a gun, but unlike these people, he didn't worship it, or have any interest in using it or displaying it when off duty. It was a work tool, nothing more. One he prayed to not have to use. He believed the average private citizen was more in danger with a gun than without, an opinion bolstered by statistics. Proven by the CT shooter's mother's fate. He believed in the right to have a gun for hunting or protection, but would have been horrified at the arsenals the gun nuts are building now.
Sane people don't want their children taught by an army. They want them taught by educators. I have nothing against security officers in schools where needed. These are the people who should be toting the guns.
They yammer about God not being in the schools. God was present when teachers had the grace and courage to behave as they did.
The second amendment provides for a WELL REGULATED MILITIA. These gun nuts are the absolute opposite of well regulated. They dream of a chance to machine gun down a perceived threat and a society that has regressed to operating like the wild west. They were in the process of destroying the formerly peaceful Newtown, CT, with their carrying on when the tragedy happened. The shooter's mother was a part of that culture, and basically, she reaped what she sowed.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Populist says... December 20, 2012 at 11:17 a.m.
T6,
Oh the ad hominem ranting. Satan aka the people at the NRA did have a hand in the deaths of these children. You can't fight for years to protect the rights of people to have their assault weapons and then not realize the consequences of that fight. If you want to protect the right of the gun nuts to enjoy their killing machines, let's not be hypocritical and deny that the price to be paid for that enjoyment is the death of innocent citizens when a nut gets hold of the many guns in circulation. The more dangerous weapons in circulation the higher the chances that a nut will get hold of one and kill many people. As to spending on mental health, you right wingers always want to cut it.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 20, 2012 at 12:09 p.m.
We've really worn this out. Both sides reject the other outright and we have degenerated into meaningless name calling. I'd say we were split about 50-50, much like the nation at large. I will depend on the republicans I sent to congress to block the democratic agenda. I will depend on the democrat I sent to congress to block the republican agenda. This is where I see peace reign.
~
If the democrats win this gun battle, as they have done with health care and other massive social spending agendas, it will make only one major difference to the country. Hatred will grow.
~
Let there be no doubt that this issue will further polarize an already split nation. When two sides are so fecrociously opposed and one side is able to gain enough advantage to force the other side to bend to its will, the result is not love. It leads to greater division, greater strife, greater possibilities for civil unrest.
~
I have no doubt that the views expressed on this subject are deeply held beliefs. When one's convictions are challanged, it is an affront to one's moral character. When it becomes impossible to transport facts through this fog of offense, compromise dies. These are the cases which should resolve in stalemate. This allows both sides to retrun to their corners and tensions decline.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Pobucker says... December 20, 2012 at 12:20 p.m.
Even populist has resorted to name calling. When the civilized among us go to the mud, we have gone much too far.
~
A futile attempt at fact sharing:
There is a reason the last assualt weapon ban was allowed to lapse. Written in the bill was an order for data collection and analysis on the effects of the assault weapon (AW) ban. The data exists if you'll just look for it. Third party analysts determined there was no positive effect from the ban.
~
An Updated Assessment of the Federal Assault Weapons Ban: Impacts on Gun Markets and
Gun Violence, 1994-2003
Report to the National Institute of Justice,
United States Department of Justice
By
Christopher S. Koper
(Principal Investigator)
With
Daniel J. Woods and Jeffrey A. Roth
June 2004
Jerry Lee Center of Criminology
University of Pennsylvania
3814 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104
~
Conclusion:
Although the ban has been successful in reducing crimes with AWs, any benefits from this reduction are likely to have been outweighed by steady or rising use of non-banned semiautomatics with Large Capacity Magazines (LCMs), which are used in crime much more frequently than AWs. Therefore, we cannot clearly credit the ban with any of the nation’s recent drop in gun violence. And, indeed, there has been no discernible reduction in the lethality and injuriousness of gun violence, based on indicators like the percentage of gun crimes resulting in death or the share of gunfire incidents resulting in injury, as we might have expected had the ban reduced crimes with both AWs and LCMs.
~
What they are saying is, if you want a ban to work, you have to do like europe and austrailia and basically ban or severely restrict ALL firearms. Only then will you see a drop in firearm related deaths. Of course, you will see a rise in deaths caused by other instruments of killing, but what the hell - who cares.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 20, 2012 at 12:56 p.m.
yes bs those kids don`t or should not be driving but they were also not doing the shooting.you should try listening to some reason just because in your liberal world where you want to be told every move to be made because your not smart enough to think for yourself does not mean the rest of us want to live like that.statisics will prove more kids are killed by cars than ar-15 but because you personally have no use for them you want them banned.i personally own a ar-15 and several cars that excede the speed limit.statisics also prove that its more likely for one of my cars to be stolen and involved in a wreck than one of my ar`s to be used in a crime.if your going to go after things that are a danger to others go after them all.i would also think a adult is more likely to get drunk and drive than a 6 or 7 yr old geeez what a idiot.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 20, 2012 at 1:16 p.m.
Always remember that to your garden-variety liberal symbolism trumps substance everytime. That, Po, is why your facts will fall on deaf ears. The fundamental question is will the proposed gun control laws actually work for America? Any other question is irrelevent. Whatever the proposal, is there any evidence it would make any difference whatsoever to the question? For example what percentage of gun deaths over the past 20 years was a military platform gun with high capacity magazine used that resulted in multiple deaths (3 or more)? Without benefit of exactness, what percentage of that percentage would be prevented by any specific proposed solution? I've done the math, and using 50% as a reasonable number, gun and magazine bans would at best under any circumstance save 2 lives per year or about .025% of the total. Now, consider the trade-off of restricting gun rights to 100 million Americans who see possession of a military platform rifle with high capacity mags as a right of liberty to protect property and pursue happiness (hunting, target shooting, collecting, etc.). Is the trade-off reasonable? Please convice me.
Hey Ronal - One man's "lame reason" is another's right guaranteed under the US Constitution. That doucment is anything but lame. Would you consider the shop owner during the LA riots to be "lame" when he and his son manned the rooftop of his business with military platform guns and high capacity magazines (people put "clips" in their hair) to make sure they could outgun the bad guys trying to loot their place of business?
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 20, 2012 at 2:52 p.m.
Packman...... If it ever happened, and I hope it does not, that those 2 lives in your statistical tirade were you family members, please come back and update us if your feelings have change a bit.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 20, 2012 at 4:43 p.m.
Populist.... You fancy yourself an intelligent person but show you're sorely lacking in that department. CRIMINALS don't obey the law. You could take away all guns from legal owners and we would be at the mercy of criminals who have the guns and won't hesitate to use them on anybody and everybody.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 20, 2012 at 5:06 p.m.
Pop... Guess you didn't read Adam Lanza was a Satanist. He worshiped the devil and had an online page dedicated to Satan. No way to ban EVIL!!!!
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 21, 2012 at 7:57 p.m.
pobunker..........NRA says put security guards in schools, that has been done:
In 1999, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold killed 15 people and wounded 23 more at Columbine High School. The destruction occurred despite the fact that there was an armed security officer at the school and another one nearby -- exactly what LaPierre argued on Friday was the answer to stopping "a bad guy with a gun."
*
If the nut case of a shooter is going to blow his own brains out after, is he really going to be deterred by security guards, that have to go to the bathroom, office maybe even eat lunch somewhere. Will they be in the right place at the right time in every school?
*
( permalink | suggest removal )
RonalFos says... December 22, 2012 at 8:58 a.m.
There is no constitutional right to own or carry any particular type of weapon. The government has the right and responsibility to limit rights for the common good. You don't have the right to drive as fast as you want, you don't have the right to drive drunk, use heroin, meth and other dangerous drugs even though all of this may be in your definition of pursuit of happiness because they are contrary to the common good. Limits are coming so you may as well start getting over it.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 22, 2012 at 9:36 a.m.
rf so whats your saying is to be safer all we need are more laws.....like the ones we can`t inforce now?all your ban will achieve is to turn a bunch of law abiding citizens into law breakers and you will see lots of pvc pipe getting buried.
ok libs since you will not answer any of the other questions let me ask another one for you not to answer.do you know how to make black powder?it has a simple recipe from items that are easy to get,google it and you will find multiple ways to make it.i think both sides agree this guy was evil and had no reguard for his on life.my question is what would the death count have been if he could not have gotten a gun but instead built a bomb and took it into the cafeteria at lunch time?you want to blame the gun but most of these killers have above avg iq`s and would have found a way to see out thier goal one way or the other.
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 22, 2012 at 1:21 p.m.
The delaying tactic of the gun nuts is to refuse any idea until it proves it can stop 100% of gun deaths. Since that would be impossible, they get to keep spreading more and more carnage throughout the land, rather than helping to lessen it. Ronal is right; change is coming.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 22, 2012 at 1:33 p.m.
Lazybar.... What it comes down to, is if the Left doesn't think we need it WE don't get to keep it! Constitution be damned.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 22, 2012 at 1:55 p.m.
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 22, 2012 at 1:58 p.m.
T6....regarding Columbine:
At 11:19 a.m., a witness heard Eric Harris yell "Go! Go!" At that moment, the two gunmen pulled out their guns from beneath their trenchcoats and Harris began shooting with his 9 mm semi-automatic carbine at two 17-year-old students who had been sitting upon a grassy knoll next to the West Entrance of the school
At approximately 11:24 a.m., a Jefferson County deputy sheriff arrived and began shooting at Harris and Klebold, distracting them from the injured Brian Anderson.[4] (Anderson escaped to the library and hid inside an open staff break room.) Harris fired a total of ten shots at the officer, who reported a Code 33 (officer in need of emergency assistance) to his colleagues
Two SWAT teams entered the school at 1:09 p.m
The armed policeman was there 4 minutes after the shooting started. The Swat teams did not enter the school until 1:09 fifty minutes after the shooting started. What took the swat teams so long to enter the building, this is what they are paid to do. So yes, there was good guys there with guns, but they still did not take out the killers.
( permalink | suggest removal )
RonalFos says... December 22, 2012 at 2:03 p.m.
If change in gun laws are coming it will not be just the left. They alone can't do anything in this country. It will be due to outrage by moderates and even some conservatives. I will say it again, the Constitution doesn't say a word about what you are allowed own only that you can own something.
( permalink | suggest removal )
aimee says... December 22, 2012 at 3:09 p.m.
This is "the straw that broke the camel's back"... The NRA has exactly -0- credibility now... All they want to do is to sell guns, so, of course, the answer for them is MORE guns... What idiots..!!!
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 22, 2012 at 5:13 p.m.
"A WELL REGULATED MILITIA, BEING NECESSARY TO THE SECURITY OF A FREE STATE, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."
Just what militia does the average over the top gun nut belong to, and who the hell has been regulating him?
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 22, 2012 at 11:30 p.m.
If more guns will make us safer as the NRA promotes, why are we not the safest country in the world since we have more guns than any other country in the world? Need some logical comments on this.
( permalink | suggest removal )
RonalFos says... December 23, 2012 at 8:55 a.m.
The 2nd amendment says you may be armed but it doesn't say what you may be armed with. For all you constitutional purist, if you go back to when the amendment was written you would be allowed to have a flintlock and I'm sure most people would be ok with that these days. The American people are going to decide what kind of society they want to live in and I don't think a sea to sea military grade garrison is what they have in mind.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 23, 2012 at 9:11 a.m.
bs why are new york and chicago not the safest cities in america?
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 23, 2012 at 9:44 a.m.
RF, BS, IN, AIM...... China is the biggest offender of human rights, WHY do you think China wants our government to ban our guns? When They become our landlords they don't want a gun behind every blade of grass!
CARACAS, Venezuela — Venezuela's government banned sales of guns and ammunition Friday with a measure that officials said is aimed at fighting rampant violent crime.
Private gun shops are now prohibited from selling guns under the measure, which had been announced previously.
Only the police and the military will be exempt from the ban on gun sales, Justice Minister Tareck El Aissami said.
Critics noted that only a small percentage of guns have recently been sold legally to permit holders and said most gun sales have long been illegal and unregulated.
Luis Izquiel, a lawyer who heads a security committee for Venezuela's opposition coalition, said that while there are about 25,000 gun permits legally registered with the authorities, there are many more weapons on the streets. In 2010, Amnesty International estimated there were a total of 10 million firearms in the country.
"Here criminals don't use legal firearms," Izquiel said.
( permalink | suggest removal )
23cal says... December 23, 2012 at 9:56 a.m.
Q: How many NRA members does it take to screw in a light bulb?
*
A: More guns!
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 23, 2012 at 10:21 a.m.
I challenge any of you Libs on here to put up a sign in front of your house with "THIS HOUSE IS A GUN FREE ZONE" and see how that works out for you.
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 23, 2012 at 10:34 a.m.
I think someone on the left on here said the Republicans were the ones to cut funding for school security programs. Not so!! But guess who did?
washingtonguardian. com/washingtons-school-security-failure
So while Obama and his merry band of thugs(DemocRats) cry for gun bans they are not concerned with keeping schools safe. THEY ARE AFTER our 2nd amendment rights. Scratch that! THEY are after the CONSTITUTION. PERIOD!!!
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 23, 2012 at 11:27 a.m.
T6....again I ask for a source of information where you got "WHY do you think China wants our government to ban our guns"
lazybar...........
Urban states with heavy gang populations such as California and New York aren't particularly high up on the list of per-capita gun killings, though of course in terms of absolute numbers they look like murder capitals because of their big populations. Mid-size Southern states seem to be the places people are trigger-happiest -- and where, of course, political opposition to gun control often runs strongest. Perhaps that's because most of the bloodletting happens in Southern cities, and it's in rural areas -- where gun violence is slight -- that gun rights are held most sacred.
( permalink | suggest removal )
aimee says... December 23, 2012 at 5:01 p.m.
lazybar:
.
New York and Chicago are unsafe BECAUSE they have so many guns...!!! Glad you are finally seeing the light..!!!
.
"Chicago and the state of Illinois have seen gun-control measures thrown out by federal courts, most recently this month when the 7th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals rejected a ban on carrying concealed firearms. City Council member Joe Moore said there is only so much that local authorities can do.
.
“'Obviously, we’ve got a problem. Gun violence is way too high in Chicago,' said Moore, whose district lies on the quieter North Side. 'Sensible gun regulations really have to be done on a national level. Because guns are so transportable, you can’t rely on cities or even states to carry the burden.'
.
"...Ron Smith sees the young men and their guns as they pass in front of his window at League Styles Barber Shop. “They all have ’em,” he said."
.
washingtonpost. com/national/chicago-grapples-with-gun-violence-murder-toll-soars/2012/12/20/b16601fe-4a1e-11e2-ad54-580638ede391_story_1.html
.
"New York already has some of the nation’s strictest gun laws. But their usefulness falters when people travel to a state with weaker gun laws and return home to commit a crime — trafficking that happens in about one-third of gun crimes nationwide, according to Mayors Against Illegal Guns, a group started by Bloomberg to urge Washington to create more standardized gun laws."
.
"Some say the state-by-state approach isn’t working, including Syracuse Mayor Stephanie Miner, New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg and Cuomo.
.
“The real answer is federal,” the governor said last week. “I want to see the Congress pass something.”
.
syracuse. com/news/index.ssf/2012/12/more_new_york_state_gun_laws_w.html
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 24, 2012 at 9:06 a.m.
aimmee what a dumbazz you are,might it be that only ciminals are allowed handguns in chicago?
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 24, 2012 at 1:34 p.m.
T6...........Need the opinion of a person that's obviously a better Christain than this old DemocRat as you put it. Knowing Jesus as you obviously do from your wisdom that you have recieved from His teaching, do you believe he would be for an asault weapons ban and like you and the NRA more armed guards in the schools. Just asking. Could you expand on the meaning of Matthew 5:9 "Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God."
( permalink | suggest removal )
aimee says... December 24, 2012 at 2:39 p.m.
lazy:
.
..."allowed" to have handguns in Chicago..??? You've got to be kidding...!!!
.
If they do have handguns, they need to be confiscated... THAT will not happen overnight... As our president said:
.
"The fact that this problem is complex can no longer be an excuse for doing nothing. The fact that we can’t prevent every act of violence doesn’t mean we can’t steadily reduce the violence.” -President Barack Obama, December 19, 2012
( permalink | suggest removal )
T6 says... December 24, 2012 at 3:32 p.m.
BS.....James 1:26, Those who consider themselves religious and yet do not keep a tight rein on their tongues deceive themselves, and their religion is worthless.
( permalink | suggest removal )
RonalFos says... December 24, 2012 at 3:52 p.m.
Amen T6. If only you would listen to your own words!
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 24, 2012 at 11:54 p.m.
T6, packman, lazybar....The Fort Hood shooter used this pistol:
The Five-seven pistol was developed in conjunction with the FN P90 personal defense weapon and the FN 5.7×28mm cartridge.[15] The P90 was introduced in 1990, and the Five-seven was introduced in 1998 as a pistol using the same 5.7×28mm ammunition.[7] Developed as a companion pistol to the P90, the Five-seven shares many of its design features: it is a lightweight polymer-based weapon with a large magazine capacity, ambidextrous controls, low recoil, and the ability to penetrate body armor when using certain cartridge types.[16]
Sales of the Five-seven were originally restricted by FN to military and law enforcement customers, but since 2004, the pistol has also been offered to civilian shooters for personal protection, target shooting, and similar uses. Although offered only with sporting ammunition, the Five-seven's introduction to civilian shooters was met with vocal opposition from gun control organizations such as the Brady Campaign, and the pistol has been subject to ongoing controversy in the United States.
*
You gun nuts have no problem at all with a pistol that will shoot Cop Killings Bullets that penetrate body armor. What about the shooter that wears body armor and goes to the school to shoot 6 year old's with their designer youth body armor on, he will have to make sure he has the right amunition, right. A company in Utah (Amendment II) is making body armor for kids. Wake up people! Is this what you want schools in America to be like?
Locked Down, bars, armed guards, kids wearing body armor, maybe the armed guard holding his Bushmaster when the bell rings to welcome the 1st grader to the battle ground instead of the school ground. We don't want our guard to be out gunned by the shooter do we. Is this what you want in order to protect the right of the wanabe Rambo's of the world so they can get their jollies by shooting their Bushmasters, FN Five-seven's and Tec 9's with LCM. The kids will have to have their personal shrink's from the 2nd grade on.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 25, 2012 at 12:55 p.m.
T6....go here to buy your grandkids disigner body armor. Who will buy it for the kids who's parents can not afford it. Oh, I know for them it's the old conservative motto's "sink or swim" "sh it out of luck" or they are one of the 47% who wants a handout. Would you be for the government to pay for razor wire to be installed at all schools?
amendment2 . com/shop/centurion-tactical-vest-for-children/
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 26, 2012 at 10:52 a.m.
aimmee so you think the criminals are just gonna turn them in?wow, all i can say is wow.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 26, 2012 at 12:43 p.m.
lazybar......laws we pass today may not do any good right now, but in 20 years maybe so, that's what counts, you have to start.
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 26, 2012 at 5:50 p.m.
Not limiting availability of these assault weapons and huge magazines just because it won't prevent every death makes as much sense as keeping antibiotics off the market because they won't save every life. This is just the gun nuts tactic for stopping any progress in the untenable situation. They prefer fake macho swagger to saving any lives at all. The unarmed old lady who helped take down the Gifford shooter was braver and smarter than any gun nut.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 27, 2012 at 9:08 a.m.
bs,the gun laws in ny and chicago have neen in effect as long as i can remember and the criminals are the only ones with guns.how exactly has that benefitted the law abiding citizens?
iquire the only fake machos i know is the one sitting in front of your screen.your for killing jobs and taking away our rights but you still want to draw your monthly check.don`t worry we are headed for a totally socialist nation and you will be taken care of for the next few years but within the next decade and probably sooner will be just like greece.
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 27, 2012 at 11:05 a.m.
Lazybar, I don't get a monthly check from anywhere. My husband gets a pension that he worked for for 34 years, and social security that he paid into for 46 years, and a small disability insurance supplement that he paid high premiums into for about 20 years. So take your ignorant false accusations and stick them where they belong.
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 27, 2012 at 6:46 p.m.
Lazybar, we have been self supporting since high school, and have never, ever, been on welfare or food stamps or medicaid. Neither has anyone in our family. EVER. This bull you spout is exactly why Romney and his 47% clap trap lost. The working class people of this country resent being talked down to as it they had never worked.
We did both take advantage of the public education offered. That is why we can spell, use punctuation, and know when to capitalize.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 28, 2012 at 9:20 a.m.
yes inquire that might be true that you excelled in your english classes but its easy to see you failed math.
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 28, 2012 at 2:03 p.m.
I never failed math or anything else. You, lazybar, apparently failed both truth and compassion.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 28, 2012 at 2:13 p.m.
i feel plenty of compassion for those that are willing to get off thier rears and work but i have no compassion for those that feel the government owes them something
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 28, 2012 at 3:48 p.m.
'Not limiting availability of these assault weapons and huge magazines just because it won't prevent every death makes as much sense as keeping antibiotics off the market because they won't save every life." This is possibly the dumbest post ever. The appropriate analogy would be banning military platform rifles and high capacity mags would be like banning cars with V8 engines.
After a week's worth of debate the anti-gun nuts cannot provide even a shred of evidence banning military platform rifles or high capacity mags would either a) decrease the murder rate or b) have prevented what happened at Columbine, Newtown, or any other notable places where madmen with guns killed multiple people. The "ban" hysteria is being used purely for political purposes to stock the non-intellect of the typical useful idiot. To the contrary, all objective studies show bans DO NOT work. What the anti-gun nuts always conveniently omit from their arguments is a simple economic principle - the law of substitutes. Any ban other than total confiscation ignores the reality that the madmen could have easily used substitutes to kill multiple people. Everything from a squirrel rifle with numerous mags to a shotgun loaded with double OO buck to a pipe bomb could have been equally devastating. If the anti-gun nuts were serious, they would advocate for a total ban and repeal of the 2nd Amendment. Anything less and they are just being played for fools.
( permalink | suggest removal )
inquire says... December 28, 2012 at 6:02 p.m.
Lazybar, people with compassion, or truthfulness, do NOT snidely and erroneously insinuate that people who have worked all their lives to EARN pensions, and PAID INTO social security and medicare and private disability insurance, are some sort of welfare people just waiting around for a check that they have not EARNED.
Until you are educated enough to understand the difference between retired WORKING people and the never worked welfare crowd, and quit making your snide, lying comments, you do not know compassion or truth. Own it.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 28, 2012 at 11:25 p.m.
Packman...........
Gun homicides per 100,000 people: US .98 Canada .5
The stated intent of Canadian firearms laws is to control firearms so as to improve public safety. Canadians have a somewhat limited access to firearms, but are still able to purchase them with relative ease. Licensing provisions of the Firearms Act endeavours to ensure proper training and safe storage.
1. Non-Restricted: Long guns with an overall length greater than 26 inches and, if semi-automatic, a barrel which is 18 1/2 inches or longer. These can be possessed with an ordinary PAL, and are the only class of firearms which can be used for hunting, due to the ATT (Authorization to Transport) requirement for Restricted and Prohibited weapons, as well as provincial regulations. This class includes most popular sporting rifles and shotguns.
2. Restricted: This includes handguns with barrel lengths greater than 4.1 inches (105mm), and long guns which do not meet the length requirements for non-restricted, and are not prohibited. These guns require ATTs, and as such can only be shot at ranges. These arms can be possessed with an RPAL, which is similar to the PAL course, but covers restricted weapons and the increased storage requirements. One must pass the CFSC as well as the RCFSC in order to obtain their RPAL. Examples in this class include all AR-15 variants.
3. Prohibited: These weapons generally cannot be possessed by civilians. Normally, the only way to possess these is by being grandfathered in or inheriting a pistol with a barrel length at or under 4.1 inches (105mm), in which case the individual may receive the Class 7 endorsement. This class also includes prohibited devices. Many military arms fall under this classification, including all AK variants, and the FN-FAL. All handguns with a barrel length equal to or under 4.1 inches (105mm) are prohibited, as well as those chambered in .25 or .32 caliber cartridges, presumably to prevent the manufacture of "Saturday Night Specials". Also prohibited are fully automatic weapons and suppressors. Magazines for automatic long guns capable of holding more than 5 centerfire cartridges or 10 rounds for handguns, are prohibited, with the exception of the M1 Garand, as well as carbines which use pistol magazines, such as the Beretta CX4 Storm.
School shooting resulting in death US 15 Canada 3
You said If the anti-gun nuts were serious, they would advocate for a total ban and repeal of the 2nd Amendment. Anything less and they are just being played for fools. Canada has anything less and their stats are way less than ours. Your turn Packman.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 29, 2012 at 9:11 a.m.
bs,lets say you do have a car capable of going over the speed limit.would you be willing to record everytime you take it out for a drive,how much gas you have on hand for it or how much gas you burned when you took it out for a drive?well thats canadian handgun law and one of the reasons i don`t want to live in canada.if canada is so safe why don`t you move there?grass is only greener on the otherside of the fence when its over the septic tank.
packman simple logic bypasses the antigun crowd in failing to understand why if someone was to shoot at me i`d much rather it be a crazy carrying a ar-15 with a 30rd mag than a sportsman carrying a single shot deer rifle.all they know are that guns are evil and the progunners that are willing to give up thier rights to own a military platform gun because they personally have no use for them will be willing to give up a little more next time thier rights are questioned.for you that say your for gun rights but against guns you personally have no use for,how far are you willing to go along with the antigun crowd until you say enough is enough?do you not ever fear that will be to late to reverse what you supported when we are not even allowed to own a firearm in years to come?
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 29, 2012 at 10:31 a.m.
lazybar........that's the "slippery slope" verbage you and the religious right want to use to scare other gun owners. The Canadians have plenty of guns and are able to go hunting and to the rifle range, there are some restrictions on AR,FN and AK style rifles, the woman arrested for buying the AR-15 at Gander Mountain for the fireman killer,probably would not have done so in Canada.
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 29, 2012 at 2:17 p.m.
bs have you ever been to canada?did you visit the liberal french areas like ontario or did you see the real canadians?if had of ever been there hunting you would know even singleshot t/c contenders are far and few between because of thier gun laws.
( permalink | suggest removal )
BillSmith says... December 30, 2012 at 12:16 p.m.
lazybar.......Yes I have, Ear Falls Ontario Kabeelo Lodge and you can hunt bear and moose with modern guns, so don't tell people you can't and make out like all you can use is a bow or black powder.
( permalink | suggest removal )
Packman says... December 30, 2012 at 5:58 p.m.
BillSmith - Bless your heart, are you really so ignorant as to not see the flaw in your data? How many guns were in private ownership in Canada per 100,000 people prior to enactment of their restrictive laws? How many in the US? Without confiscation of what already exists, you are being played for a fool. You also ignore factors of causation. It must also be pointed out the current proposal from anti-gun nuts is nothing like the gun laws in Canada. If you are going to make comparisons, keep it apples and apples. Otherwise, stupid is as stupid does. Your turn.......
( permalink | suggest removal )
lazybar says... December 31, 2012 at 9:16 a.m.
oh sweet bs,when did i make out like you could not use a modern gun to hunt in canada?the myth about bear hunting is that you need a big gun.i have a t/c contender in a 7mm-08 that i would not be scared to shoot a black bear with but in canada it is illegal for me to carry.if i lived in canada and i owned the same firearm i would have to keep a record of everytime i shot it,sorry but no thanks.
and yet here again do you have a clue why i`d rather a crazy be shooting at me with a ar-15 vs sportsman a blackpowder firearm or bow?i figure you to stupid to know so i`ll give you a hint .223 vs 1.25 or .223 vs .50
( permalink | suggest removal )
To report abuse or misuse of this area please hit the "Suggest Removal" link in the comment to alert our online managers. Read our Terms of Use policy.