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Gun bill collides with states' rights

Reciprocity backers cite armed travelers arrested out of state

By MICHAEL CATALINI The Associated Press

This article was published December 26, 2017 at 4:30 a.m.

shaneen-allen-an-advocate-for-the-second-amendment-speaks-last-year-during-a-pro-gun-rally-at-capitol-square-in-richmond-va

Shaneen Allen, an advocate for the Second Amendment, speaks last year during a pro-gun rally at Capitol Square in Richmond, Va.

TRENTON, N.J. -- The handgun that Shaneen Allen was carrying when she was pulled over on a New Jersey highway could have sent her to prison for years.

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Displaying 1 - 10 of 10 total comments

mozarky2 says... December 26, 2017 at 5:55 a.m.

So I suppose this means states may also put limits on the other nine amendments to the Bill of Rights...?

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RBear says... December 26, 2017 at 6:15 a.m.

This issue creates a challenge between 2nd Amendment advocates and 10th Amendment advocates, both typically in the right wing of our political climate. But one can only look to elections to see how this can be settled. Our Constitution guarantees the right to vote to citizens of the nation, but has deferred to states in deciding how those votes can be cast. The VRA is designed only to insure those elections are carried out fairly and without favor to one group or another.
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Of course, moz flunks the con law test with his quick quip of the day, forgetting that there are seventeen other amendments in our Constitution.

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GCW says... December 26, 2017 at 6:30 a.m.

Voters in that state must be thrilled to foot the bill for those jail stays.

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23cal says... December 26, 2017 at 7:12 a.m.

About "I thought my license was just like a driver's license," she said."
One of the very, very few things they taught in the Arkansas CC class which I attended was that some states allow concealed carry, some don't, and when traveling you need to find out in advance which is which. If this woman wasn't knowledgeable and responsible enough to do something that basic and simple, then she doesn't fit the label of "Responsible Gun Owner(tm)" which the right wing gun nuts are always blathering about and which in reality means "Anyone who can get their hands on a gun."
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The CC class I attended was a joke, and I can understand why some states wouldn't want incompetent and untrained Arkies cruising around there packing heat. 90% of class time was spent on how to fill out the application. The shooting "test" consisted of allowing an applicant to shoot at replaced targets until eventually they hit the paper enough times. There was no limit on how many attempts they got to take. Gun safety and psychological preparation weren't even a blip on the radar.
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It seems reasonable that if there is going to be a nationwide CC permit, it would only make sense to have nationwide requirements and testing to achieve that permit. As a frequent traveler, I would like to see a universal permit. However, as someone who has been through the course here, I understand and support states which are against this particular bill.
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For the inevitable Second Amendment droolers such as Moz, rights aren't absolute. This is long established constitutional jurisprudence, which explains why they can't grasp that idea. Freedom of speech doesn't allow slander, freedom of religion doesn't allow human sacrifice, and the second amendment doesn't allow any person to have any weapon at any time in any location. If firearms can be banned in courtrooms and jails, then concealed permits can be banned from state to state.

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LR1955 says... December 26, 2017 at 11:22 a.m.

If everyone would just obey the laws, keep their lips zipped about their CHCL, and keep their weapon concealed, I don’t think there world be any problems.

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GeneralMac says... December 26, 2017 at 1:01 p.m.

23Cal...........New Jersey does have a permit to carry law,although the info I read said one has to be " very rich or have connections" to get a permit.

Thus, she WAS in a state that allows you to carry with a permit.

This rebukes your 2nd sentence .

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GeneralMac says... December 26, 2017 at 1:03 p.m.

LR1955.............are you stating when a person who has a concealed weapon permit they should NOT tell police they have a fire arm when pulled over?

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Packman says... December 26, 2017 at 1:14 p.m.

The 2nd Amendment applies nationally. As a practical matter cc laws need some consistency between the states due to interstate transportation.
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Hey 23cal - My cc class as a little more rigorous than what you describe but still not incredibly difficult. I agree with tougher requirements for interstate cc permit. But you must also acknowledge your arrogance and bias using phrases like "including incompetent and untrained Arkies". As poor as the training you received might have been it's better than no training. You also ignore that lawbreakers transport firearms at will.

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23cal says... December 26, 2017 at 2:39 p.m.

GeneralMac....about "23Cal...........New Jersey does have a permit to carry law,although the info I read said one has to be " very rich or have connections" to get a permit.

Thus, she WAS in a state that allows you to carry with a permit.

This rebukes your 2nd sentence ."
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Apparently, you think a Pennsylvania permit in New Jersey is the same as a New Jersey permit in New Jersey. You would be wrong about that.
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"All firearms transported into the State of New Jersey:

Shall be carried unloaded and contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, securely tied package, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported, and in the course of travel, shall include only such deviations as are reasonably necessary under the circumstances.
The firearm should not be directly accessible from the passenger compartment of the vehicle. If the vehicle does not have a compartment separate from the passenger compartment, the firearm and ammunition must be in a locked container other than the vehicle's glove compartment or console."
New Jersey State Police website w ww.njsp.or g/firearms/transport-firearm.sht ml
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Since I travel quite a bit, I keep up to date on which states have reciprocity with Arkansas---which is fairly similar to Pennsylvania, where the lady in this article is from. There are about 17 states which do not have reciprocity with hardly any other states, and New Jersey is one of them.

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Whippersnapper says... December 26, 2017 at 11 p.m.

23cal says rights aren't absolute. Just out of curiosity, do you support the federal government forcing every state to acknowledge every other state's marriage licenses, or should Arkansas be allowed to limit their issuance? Oh yeah, the Supreme Court declared that states must acknowledge marriage licenses from other states, so why should carry permits be any different? Well maybe if one of them was a federal right explicitly protected by the constitution... Oh yeah, one of them is and it isn't marriage.

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